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紅茶とお菓子について書いているほっこりブログです

「転載禁止なんて言ってない」と述べはじめた2ちゃんねる新運営

2ch


2ちゃんねるの新運営陣が「ブログの転載禁止なんて言っていない。転載禁止の意味がよくわからなかったのよ」と発言して、再び混乱状態になっています。

まとめ
JIMが問題にしてたのは、ログ速のような完全転載サイト
過去ログを解放して、そのPVで儲けるつもりだから害悪

ケンモウ民これを、アフィサイトだと誤認
・JIMはまとめサイトは良いと思ってる。
・JIMは個人的にまとめサイトを運用してる。
ようするに”まとめサイト”の認識違い
完全にけんもう民の勘違い。
http://qb5.2ch.net/test/read.cgi/operate/1394179030/18

詳しくは以下のエントリーに詳しく書かれてます。

転載禁止なんて誰がいってんだ?俺はまとめサイトと協力するため無断複製禁止を宣言したんだ」2ちゃんねる新管理人がグーグル翻訳に「転載禁止」をぶち込み誤訳死亡した説浮上 (Birth of Blues)
まとめサイト逆転満塁ホームランか 風雲急を告げる2ch情勢(はてな匿名ダイアリー)
2ちゃんねるの管理人ジム・ワトキンス氏、"All rights reserved."をGoogle翻訳し「転載禁止」と出てきて意味を取り違えるの巻(最終防衛ライン2)

2ちゃんねるクローンで転載OKのオープン2ちゃんねるでは、早速この話題で盛り上がり、複数のまとめサイトが取り上げていました。
JIM「転載禁止なんてだれがいってんだ?俺はまとめサイトと協力するために無断複製禁止と言った」(ニュース速報(VIP)@オープン2ちゃんねる)

JIM氏の問題となった発言は、以下のスレッド。英語だらけでキチンと翻訳する時間もスキルもないので、そのまま貼っておきます。(このスレッドでやたらオイドンのリンクが貼られていてビックリしましたが)
Let's talk with Jim-san in operate. ★5

211:Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 08:20:18.51 ID:???0
>>206
That is not going to happen. I think you are confused about All Rights Reserved,
and reproduction prohibited.
All Rights Reserved means that we reserve the right to enforce rights.
I have no intention of stopping Matome sites. I encourage them. What I don't
want are websites abusing resources, and abusing our good will.
You know who they are. They are the ones making this thread chaos.

221 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 10:01:09.56 ID:LlKEjLih0
>>211意訳
意訳
ちょっとまってください。あなたはALL Rights Reserved(無断複製禁止)とreproduction prohibited(転載禁止)を混同しているようです。
ALL Rights Reservedとは(と示すことは)我々は自らが持つ権利(著作権)を行使する意思があるということです(意志があることを示すことです)。私はまとめサイトを潰すつもりはなく、彼らと協力したいと思っています。ただ、彼らが我々のリソースを乱用したり、善意を裏切るようなことを許しません。あなたは彼らが誰かを知っているし。彼らのうちのあるものたちはこのスレを混乱させている。

272 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 12:57:01.73 ID:a3A9UD0W0
Hi Jimsan.
KENMOU proposed the polling here in ν速+. then without enough discussion nor time they did it.
We as the inhabitants can't accept the result.
Because that procedure isn't right. So I declare all process is invalid.
Please give the discussion a chance, and then revoting by residents.

(要約:ジムさん、ν速+の転載禁止投票は、公正なものでないので受け入れることができないよ)

281 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 13:08:30.11 ID:???0
>>272
I will be looking at all of that tonight. I have given notice of that. Unfortunately this thread
has become a little bit chaotic. Would you help me? If you think there are irregularities
Please make a separate thread that includes all of the votes that are done, that I have not looked
at yet. On that thread, please post the voting results for the boards and any arguments saying
they are not valid. I will look at these.
As far as the name changes go. I don't think it is such a problem. They can be changed back
easily if it makes a problem.
One thing I have noticed is a confusion among some people.
All Rights Reserved can still be reprinted by Matome, just we reserve rights to that data
and there may be a system in place to keep track of it, and even charge for the use if it
becomes necessary, or if the data is abused a legal take down notice could be sent to the abuser.
I am not accepting current votes for Reproduction prohibited.

319 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 13:40:07.47 ID:LlKEjLih0
>>281の意訳
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
>>272
今晩それを見てみます。それについて一言申し上げると、そのスレはひどく混乱しています。
申し訳ないんですけど、私がまだ見ていない投票結果を含む別スレを立てていただけませんか。
そのスレには、投票結果とその投票結果は無効だとする意見をすべて記載していただけると助かります。
ところで、ある人たちが混乱しているようなので説明します。名前欄の変更は簡単に元に戻すこともできるので大きな問題だとは思っていません。ただ、All Rights Reserved(無断複製禁止)であっても(無断複製禁止と表示しても)、まとめサイトは複製することも可能だということです。われわれはデーターへの権利を持っているということなんです。(All Rights Reservedと示すことは我々が著作権者であることを示すということなんです)
必要があれば、まとめサイトからトラックバックさせるシステムを構築することになるかもしれないし、使用料を払ってもうことになるかもしれない。また、まとめサイトが法に反するようなことをすれば、削除するように要求することになります。
今行われている転載禁止を求める投票を認めるつもりはありません。

382 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 14:18:25.50 ID:0k3zyypy0
to solve this issue, you MUST do some kind of actions against these bloggers.
setting charge for reproduction of 2ch posts is good start.
btw jim, i didnt like a sentence posted by you.
>we reserve rights to that data
this is wrong. the data written by users ALSO HAS right of use to the posts.
NOONE else can give them rights unless the topic has such term of use.
these DATA which posted in 2ch is belong to you.
however, the POST ITSELF is written by users.
WE have right of quoting our posts. WE can decide which post can be quoted. not YOU.
2ch authors only got rights which you can allow quoting/reproducing in final decisions.
noone should not break this rule, simple right?
that's why we are trying to decide which boards are free to be quoted/reproduced.
check japanese law and read my post again if you are unclear to these my thoughts.
i dont think i am writing wrong.
im not big fan of hate posts. but jim, you are... disappointing us.

388 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 14:24:40.01 ID:???0
>>382
Sorry to disappoint you. You might be surprised by how nice things turn out.

409 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 14:34:37.48 ID:LlKEjLih0
>>388
I am worried about a misunderstanding on All Rights Reserved between us.
In Japan, generally speaking, when you say' All Rights Reserved to 2 Channel’,
those who want to reprint data of 2 channel must have a permission from you.
Do you request the owner of Matome sites to get a permission from you?

414 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 14:35:55.40 ID:???0
>>409
As I have said if you bothered to read my writing, and not the writing of those pushing
very hard to take advantage of the system, you would already know this answer.

439 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 14:46:42.27 ID:0k3zyypy0
>>414
your answer is unclear to me. i get his post is simple yes/no question.
and i am assuming you have given the permission of quoting 2ch posts to the matome sites.
whats your state for the matome sites anyway?
earning $$$ from matome sites are YOUR goal. not ours.
reading all these japanese text posts everybody shows biggest disappointment ever to you.

451 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 14:51:11.19 ID:???0
>>439
It can't be more clear than I have already said. You are attempting to guide a conversation
in the direction you require for your personal need. Please stop that.
Fair Use is ambiguous on purpose legally. It requires you to defend yourself. Not me
to define why. Quoting is almost always ok. I have a personal quote site myself.
That is Electric Buddha.

450 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 14:51:05.59 ID:LlKEjLih0
>>414
I don't know exactly.
There might be a misunderstanding on All Rights Reserved between us.
If we look ''All Rights Reseved'' into below,
http://ejje.weblio.jp/content/All+rights+reserved
you will find the words; 不許複製,著作権所有,無断転載禁ず,版権所有.

467 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 14:57:38.43 ID:???0
>>450
Interesting, please note that All Rights Reserved is not required to be displayed to have
rights. Both of our fine countries are party to this convention.
all rights reserved
Source: "Wiktionary" (2013/09/01 23:08 UTC version)
Phrase
all Rights reserved
( Idiomatic , law ) The Copyright Holder of a creative work reserves all Copyright - related Rights ,
Typically INCLUDING the right to publish the work , to make Derivative Works of it , to distribute it ,
to make profit from it , to license a number of THESE Rights to Other People , and to forbid THESE
the uses by any Nonauthorized People , THUS Being Entitled to Take legal Action Against infringement .
Considerations for use
Formerly USED as a notice to protect a publisher 's Copyright.
Not required in countries That Are Party to the Berne Convention as of 2000.

487 :動け動けウゴウゴ2ちゃんねる:2014/03/07(金) 15:07:18.28 ID:nWEPHAMa0
weblioだと
「転載禁止」の英語での表現
Reproduction prohibited.

■機械翻訳の結果
All rights reserved
両方出るな

476 : [´・ω・`] KD182249240077.au-net.ne.jp:2014/03/07(金) 15:01:02.91 ID:9arcurOq0
Jim-san
look at http://p2.moritapo.jp/ plz.
look at http://p2.moritapo.jp/ plz.
look at http://p2.moritapo.jp/ plz.

524 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 15:18:08.76 ID:???0
>>476
I have looked at that. It is some nonsenx put together to appear to be something that
it is not. The face is the attack did come from Brazil IPs the first day, and only after
the attack were the Brazil ips added to bbon. After which the servers returned to normal
operation.
Yesterday's attack was something different. It used a combination of spoofed IPs
and VPN ips from a PRIVATE VPN that I supplied accounts to only for the use of Brazil.
The IPs that logged into this PRIVATE VPN are logged.

735 :Grape Ape ★:2014/03/07(金) 15:59:11.74 ID:???0
So, instead of continuing to misunderstand. Let's help me write the proper words.
All Rights Reserved in Japanese.
Not reproduction prohibited.